Possible Replacement for ACL's GP40?

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Possible Replacement for ACL's GP40?
Topic Started: Oct 10 2009, 02:56 PM (97 Views)
septa105R5	Oct 10 2009, 02:56 PM Post #1
Super Transit Expert from Wayne (Main Line) to King of Prussia Posts: 385 Group: Members Member #304 Joined: February 8, 2007	Since most of Vintage GP40s in North Jersey will be retired soon mostly by ALP-45DP, does anyone knows what locomotives the GP40s running on ACL could be possibly replaced with in the future? The ALP-45DP is used for NJT to connect between electrified and non electrified area. The ALP-45DP is most likely to be operate there unsure if few of them could be on ACL. Otherwise would they be likely replaced with F40PH, P40, PL42AC, or another new straight diesel locomotive (With horsepower slightly less than PL42AC since ACL train consist are very short with four cars)?



redarrow5591	Oct 10 2009, 06:34 PM Post #2
Light Rail and Railroad Historian Posts: 939 Group: Members Member #29 Joined: April 23, 2005	The ALP45 is slated for select Bay Head to New York trains and several Raritan/High Bridge to runs on the Newark Division and Hackettstown to New York Via Montclair/Summit MidTOWN Direct runs from the Hoboken Division. After the ARC tunnel is built, some Southern Tier trains will be powered by those. They will not be used on the Atlantic City since the costs WILL outweigh the benefits.



Nabi60SFW9620	Oct 10 2009, 09:09 PM Post #3
Foamer Posts: 2,131 Group: Members Member #10 Joined: February 21, 2005	Whatever replaced the GP40s on the ACL does have to be diesel powered since the ACL is not electrified on the entire route. Either the PL42AC. Or even the same model as the MARC is suppose to be getting.



redarrow5591	Oct 11 2009, 01:39 AM Post #4
Light Rail and Railroad Historian Posts: 939 Group: Members Member #29 Joined: April 23, 2005	You'd see more P40DC's around before NJTR gets MP36's or -40's. In addition, the PL42's are restricted to 85 on the NEC while the F40PH, -FH, GP40-2B, and the P40DC is restricted to 110.



septa105R5	Oct 11 2009, 07:36 AM Post #5
Super Transit Expert from Wayne (Main Line) to King of Prussia Posts: 385 Group: Members Member #304 Joined: February 8, 2007	redarrow5591 Oct 10 2009, 06:34 PM The ALP45 is slated for select Bay Head to New York trains and several Raritan/High Bridge to runs on the Newark Division and Hackettstown to New York Via Montclair/Summit MidTOWN Direct runs from the Hoboken Division. After the ARC tunnel is built, some Southern Tier trains will be powered by those. They will not be used on the Atlantic City since the costs WILL outweigh the benefits. Oh, its all because of the distance of the ACL line of which operating a DP locomotive there is too expensive in terms of cost and savings is not a lot, especially the length of the line. If the ACES service does really need passenger lc increase its service including the addition of a cab to two of its already existing consist, they could possibly haves its locomotive switched to ALP-45DP as they need two different power sources. In exchange, possibly all of the P40DC would be sent down to ACL to replace the GP40 along with new locomotive (either new diesel locomotive from MP36 or -40, or new locomotive from Alstom for a new straight diesel locomotive for ACL line)and/or F40PH. Edited by septa105R5, Oct 11 2009, 07:47 AM.



redarrow5591	Oct 11 2009, 10:47 AM Post #6
Light Rail and Railroad Historian Posts: 939 Group: Members Member #29 Joined: April 23, 2005	septa105R5 Oct 11 2009, 07:36 AM redarrow5591 Oct 10 2009, 06:34 PM The ALP45 is slated for select Bay Head to New York trains and several Raritan/High Bridge to runs on the Newark Division and Hackettstown to New York Via Montclair/Summit MidTOWN Direct runs from the Hoboken Division. After the ARC tunnel is built, some Southern Tier trains will be powered by those. They will not be used on the Atlantic City since the costs WILL outweigh the benefits. Oh, its all because of the distance of the ACL line of which operating a DP locomotive there is too expensive in terms of cost and savings is not a lot, especially the length of the line. If the ACES service does really need passenger lc increase its service including the addition of a cab to two of its already existing consist, they could possibly haves its locomotive switched to ALP-45DP as they need two different power sources. In exchange, possibly all of the P40DC would be sent down to ACL to replace the GP40 along with new locomotive (either new diesel locomotive from MP36 or -40, or new locomotive from Alstom for a new straight diesel locomotive for ACL line)and/or F40PH. I think you're jumping the gun with how effective the ALP45DP will be. You have to remember it will be a IGBT equipped ALP44M with a pair of GenSets for running off wire. Also at $12 Million a pop, they want a quick bang to start getting some of that money back. And there is no guarantee that the '45 will perform at the required expectations. I'll expect them to be contained heavily on the North Jersey Coast and Montclair-Boonton Lines until they're proven. Also with the ALP46A coming soon, I don't see NJT buying more diesels anytime soon.



septa105R5	Oct 11 2009, 07:59 PM Post #7
Super Transit Expert from Wayne (Main Line) to King of Prussia Posts: 385 Group: Members Member #304 Joined: February 8, 2007	redarrow5591 Oct 11 2009, 10:47 AM septa105R5 Oct 11 2009, 07:36 AM redarrow5591 Oct 10 2009, 06:34 PM The ALP45 is slated for select Bay Head to New York trains and several Raritan/High Bridge to runs on the Newark Division and Hackettstown to New York Via Montclair/Summit MidTOWN Direct runs from the Hoboken Division. After the ARC tunnel is built, some Southern Tier trains will be powered by those. They will not be used on the Atlantic City since the costs WILL outweigh the benefits. Oh, its all because of the distance of the ACL line of which operating a DP locomotive there is too expensive in terms of cost and savings is not a lot, especially the length of the line. If the ACES service does really need passenger lc increase its service including the addition of a cab to two of its already existing consist, they could possibly haves its locomotive switched to ALP-45DP as they need two different power sources. In exchange, possibly all of the P40DC would be sent down to ACL to replace the GP40 along with new locomotive (either new diesel locomotive from MP36 or -40, or new locomotive from Alstom for a new straight diesel locomotive for ACL line)and/or F40PH. I think you're jumping the gun with how effective the ALP45DP will be. You have to remember it will be a IGBT equipped ALP44M with a pair of GenSets for running off wire. Also at $12 Million a pop, they want a quick bang to start getting some of that money back. And there is no guarantee that the '45 will perform at the required expectations. I'll expect them to be contained heavily on the North Jersey Coast and Montclair-Boonton Lines until they're proven. Also with the ALP46A coming soon, I don't see NJT buying more diesels anytime soon. Oh, I now know what these locomotive are intended to operate on. Let's hope some of the newer locomotives (F40PH and/or PL42AC) that may be reassigned to ACL to replace the GP40's after some F40PH and/or PL42AC's roles are taken over by DP locomotive.



redarrow5591	Oct 11 2009, 09:32 PM Post #8
Light Rail and Railroad Historian Posts: 939 Group: Members Member #29 Joined: April 23, 2005	septa105R5 Oct 11 2009, 07:59 PM redarrow5591 Oct 11 2009, 10:47 AM septa105R5 Oct 11 2009, 07:36 AM redarrow5591 Oct 10 2009, 06:34 PM The ALP45 is slated for select Bay Head to New York trains and several Raritan/High Bridge to runs on the Newark Division and Hackettstown to New York Via Montclair/Summit MidTOWN Direct runs from the Hoboken Division. After the ARC tunnel is built, some Southern Tier trains will be powered by those. They will not be used on the Atlantic City since the costs WILL outweigh the benefits. Oh, its all because of the distance of the ACL line of which operating a DP locomotive there is too expensive in terms of cost and savings is not a lot, especially the length of the line. If the ACES service does really need passenger lc increase its service including the addition of a cab to two of its already existing consist, they could possibly haves its locomotive switched to ALP-45DP as they need two different power sources. In exchange, possibly all of the P40DC would be sent down to ACL to replace the GP40 along with new locomotive (either new diesel locomotive from MP36 or -40, or new locomotive from Alstom for a new straight diesel locomotive for ACL line)and/or F40PH. I think you're jumping the gun with how effective the ALP45DP will be. You have to remember it will be a IGBT equipped ALP44M with a pair of GenSets for running off wire. Also at $12 Million a pop, they want a quick bang to start getting some of that money back. And there is no guarantee that the '45 will perform at the required expectations. I'll expect them to be contained heavily on the North Jersey Coast and Montclair-Boonton Lines until they're proven. Also with the ALP46A coming soon, I don't see NJT buying more diesels anytime soon. Oh, I now know what these locomotive are intended to operate on. Let's hope some of the newer locomotives (F40PH and/or PL42AC) that may be reassigned to ACL to replace the GP40's after some F40PH and/or PL42AC's roles are taken over by DP locomotive. Although the GP40PH's are older than the F40's, NJT intends to keep them around longer than the F40's. The GP40FH's (the F40 body with the GP40 front) are next for retirement. The PL42AC's have two problems that restrict them from the ACL. 1) They still have a tendency to break down from random things, and since there is no maintenance facility anywhere on the line, short of the 110 mile deadhead, why take the chance. 2) They have a heavy speed restriction which makes scheduling and routing deadheads a problem. If anything, I expect NJT to get more P40's from AMTRAK when the ALP45DP's start showing issues for protect services.....once they correct the trainline MU problems between those and the ALP46's.



Nabi60SFW9620	Oct 13 2009, 09:22 AM Post #9
Foamer Posts: 2,131 Group: Members Member #10 Joined: February 21, 2005	The MP36 would be a perfect choice for the ACL. MARC is getting 26 of them and they seem to be a good choice.



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